Super Mario 3D World

Everything about the Wii and its games...

Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Rurouni720 » 21 Jul 2013 22:42

ddddd wrote:
FadedAreWii wrote:Mario was just an example, but, yes, MORE Mario can help. No, I don't believe Mario is hurting them at all, NSMBU's attach rate as an example. We will see how 3DW does, which I'm sure is going to help, not hurt.

As for IPs on the other system being delayed, that's probably more likely than not. One of the systems has 8. Wouldn't take a lot to make that number look much weaker. No point in saying 20 when we are talking about two seperate systems.

Mario is not hurting Nintendo because it sells, it hurts them because its the only thing that sells well on Wii U right now. If Nintendo thinks that launching more Mario games will build an userbase that will care for Assassins Creed or Batman, they have a thing coming.


Good thing that isn't entirely the case.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby KingBroly » 22 Jul 2013 02:23

I agree that Nintendo needs more diversity in their lineup right now. Mario and platformers aren't doing Nintendo many favors. Especially when you consider that Mario Kart 8 looks like a REAL HD Mario game.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby ddddd » 22 Jul 2013 06:01

Rurouni720 wrote:
ddddd wrote:Mario is not hurting Nintendo because it sells, it hurts them because its the only thing that sells well on Wii U right now. If Nintendo thinks that launching more Mario games will build an userbase that will care for Assassins Creed or Batman, they have a thing coming.


Good thing that isn't entirely the case.

*Edited for accuracy*
I just cant see neither WW, TW101, and Pikmin 3 having the system selling power that Mario+DKC+Sonic have.
Cause those are the only games different enough from all the other exclusive AAA releases this year (and Im pretty sure only two games have a T rating). Wii U will have 5 new "E for All" platformers before the end of the year, plus Wii Party U and Wii Fit U.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Autosaver » 22 Jul 2013 18:20

KingBroly wrote:I agree that Nintendo needs more diversity in their lineup right now. Mario and platformers aren't doing Nintendo many favors. Especially when you consider that Mario Kart 8 looks like a REAL HD Mario game.


Mario Kart (Party)
Mario 3D World (Casual)
Donkey Kong Country (Casual/Hardcore)
Wii Party (Party)
Wii Fit (Casual)
Wonderful 101 (Hardcore)
Pikmin 3 (Midcore)

Seems varied.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby FadedAreWii » 22 Jul 2013 19:41

That's because you don't want to see it, ddddddddd.

You keep trying to look at it as each single game has to be a system seller without recognizing them as a whole. A gamer considering Wii U is going to look at Pikmin 3 and see there is also New Super U to buy, Nintendo Land, Monster Hunter, Lego City, etc., and 101 right around the corner.

Now that scenario come December with Mario 3D, 101, Zelda, DK, Wii Fit and Party, Sonic Legends and Mario Kart right around the corner?

That's not going to pull in a few more gamers that might want Assassin's Creed lV? I think you might have another thing coming, lol.

Edit: I'd classify Mario Kart as racing. Party Racer if you must.
Last edited by FadedAreWii on 22 Jul 2013 19:45, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby KingBroly » 22 Jul 2013 19:44

Autosaver wrote:
KingBroly wrote:I agree that Nintendo needs more diversity in their lineup right now. Mario and platformers aren't doing Nintendo many favors. Especially when you consider that Mario Kart 8 looks like a REAL HD Mario game.


Mario Kart (Party)
Mario 3D World (Casual)
Donkey Kong Country (Casual/Hardcore)
Wii Party (Party)
Wii Fit (Casual)
Wonderful 101 (Hardcore)
Pikmin 3 (Midcore)

Seems varied.


Congratulations, you don't understand what a "diverse lineup" means. It's referring to gameplay genres, not casual to hardcore. That is where Nintendo is failing to diversify Wii U's portfolio. Right now, it's primarily platformers and party games.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby FadedAreWii » 22 Jul 2013 19:47

though he misjudged that part of it, he is still right that it's kinda varied.

Action
Rts
Racing
Platforming
Party
Fitness
Action/Adventure/Rpg (zelda)

As a mod it doesn't seem like you should be so condisending to people.

His post also makes a good point that the range of gamers they are for is varied as well.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby ddddd » 22 Jul 2013 20:55

FadedAreWii wrote:That's because you don't want to see it, ddddddddd.

You keep trying to look at it as each single game has to be a system seller without recognizing them as a whole. A gamer considering Wii U is going to look at Pikmin 3 and see there is also New Super U to buy, Nintendo Land, Monster Hunter, Lego City, etc., and 101 right around the corner.

Now that scenario come December with Mario 3D, 101, Zelda, DK, Wii Fit and Party, Sonic Legends and Mario Kart right around the corner?

That's not going to pull in a few more gamers that might want Assassin's Creed lV? I think you might have another thing coming, lol.

Edit: I'd classify Mario Kart as racing. Party Racer if you must.

So you are telling me that the audience built by more than 11 E for All games (5 of them platformers) that are aimed at families with kids will also be interested in third party M games that are aimed at young male adults... :|.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Hamr » 22 Jul 2013 22:55

FadedAreWii wrote:Mario was just an example, but, yes, MORE Mario can help. No, I don't believe Mario is hurting them at all, NSMBU's attach rate as an example.


Right, which establishes that Mario sells well to existing console owners. Historical evidence and the still-abysmal hardware sales on the other hand establish that Mario's ability to push new consoles is actually extremely-limited. That is why Nintendo is 'clearly struggling more than they ever have'.

"We will see how 3DW does, which I'm sure is going to help, not hurt."

If anything, the numbers tell us that 3D Mario is the far less popular form of Mario, so it will in all likelihood have even less of an impact on hardware sales than the cavalcade of 2D Marios already present on the system.

"As for IPs on the other system being delayed, that's probably more likely than not."

You expect seven of eight games, and eleven of twelve, to all be delayed? That is what it would take for either or both consoles to have less new IPs in their respective first years than the Wii U, and that is basically unprecedented.

(I also do not think you really want to go down the road of attacking other companies over game delays.)

"One of the systems has 8. Wouldn't take a lot to make that number look much weaker."

And if we are generous, the Wii U has two. One does not need to imagine a crazy-unrealistic number of hypothetical delays to make that number look weak.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby FadedAreWii » 23 Jul 2013 01:19

Without much help, I think Mario has pushed a pretty large amount of systems. One game can only do so much, so I think you are wrong with that analysis.

This 3D Mario is at least strongly attempting to bridge the gap between those fans, so I don't think the comparison is there.

That's not what I said about the delays at all.

Your "release dates" are just as hypothetical at this point.

@dddd:

Boiling them down to just ratings isn't winning you any arguments. ;-)
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Hamr » 23 Jul 2013 03:07

FadedAreWii wrote:Without much help, I think Mario has pushed a pretty large amount of systems.


There have not been 'a large amount' of Wii Us sold in total -- let alone by NSMBU -- , so by definition objective measurement says that statement is false.

"One game can only do so much"

There are about half a dozen Mario platformers alone currently out on the Wii U.

"This 3D Mario is at least strongly attempting to bridge the gap between those fans, so I don't think the comparison is there."

Bridging the gap between 3D Mario and the vastly-more popular 2D Mario would only really be something that could help hardware sales if 2D Mario were not already failing in the most abysmal possible way to push console in any significant numbers.

"That's not what I said about the delays at all."

Hey, do not say I did not try to warn you.

"Your "release dates" are just as hypothetical at this point."

:lol:

Uh, no. Just because certain events could potentially happen to be in the future does not make them equally likely to occur. For instance, tomorrow I can eat my sandwich at work, *or* I could be squished by the vending machine as I reach in to pull that same sandwich out. That is assuming I even get that far, since when I am putting the money in, I could get hit by a meteorite!

That does not make all three possibilities equivalent in probability -- in fact the odds of the latter two occurring are actually quite low, not even worth serious consideration.

Now, this is what happens when you have a company that is patently incapable of sticking to a deadline and tries to make it look normal (even noble) when extended delays ravage their release calendars -- you end up with people who are apparently so used to it that they wind up thinking that large numbers of major games getting held back by big-name publishers is a regular, likely thing.

I hate to break it out to you, but for most game companies, massive multi-year delays are actually a fairly infrequent occurrence. The idea of a company announcing twelve games for one year and then delaying all of them except maybe one is so unrealistic that, like my end at the hands of the vending machine or the meteorite, it is honestly kind of hilarious.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Berrix » 23 Jul 2013 16:35

Half a dozen Mario platformers doesn't equate to what people, by majority, are aware of and seen. Saying this implies a HD re-release of PS2 classics sold PS3 systems, which is not naturally the case. New games genuinely affect this, not some collection of eShop games most find out about once one starts to consider any potential purchase of a new console. It just happens we're discussing Nintendo and it's Mario games. Hell, it's surprising how many are not much aware of Super Luigi U, while in the same breath mention Mario Kart 8.

Mind you, there is never a true line where it becomes 'Too Much Mario' for Nintendo consoles. You may disagree, but people take note of their shelf presence. New IPs don't. Looking into sales figures, BK/2 sold millions, sure, but didn't do much to flux the console attachment rate. Rythm Heaven sold more in a shorter time (shorter in total) than BK series, but did nothing to the sales figures of a declining Wii generation. They sold to those that already HAD a console.

Big sales are all well and good, definitely, but the universe of Miis seem to be Nintendo's only true IP that marked a major selling point that rivaled Mario during the Wii. Much of that relates to a ton of reasons, from every console carrying one of their games, to utilizing the players' creativity on their Miis into a variety of games. They were essentially an extension of one's self. THEY raced against Mario, THEY triumphed against Sonic, THEY explored new territories. THEM, not the Miis, and that's reasons that made them so damn popular.

Now, can Nintendo essentially do this with another IP? Sure, but it will take a lot of work to get their presence not only known of the IP, but of the console itself. Which they fumbled on, sure, but it's recoverable even at this point.

One way, like I mentioned before, is Mario present. Not some just chilling out at eShop, since many may not understand what all that entails from just a few signs here and there. New games from familiar series get more attention naturally, it's a nature in us all to find something we know or comparable to grow interest in certain things or hobbies. Not even the first Jak & Daxter, Resistance or Mass Effect had stellar sales compared to something from them people are aware of.

To get those sales, Nintendo needs the consoles sold enough to REACH those numbers. Simple fact.

On a side note; We do not know of all the supposed new IPs Sony is making in the supposed next year. Some may be delayed a year, some may be delayed into oblivion. That's not even counting some may merge into other projects, others change into an existing IP (like Mario and Luigi from the title Tomato Adventure), complete cancellation and even be an 'app' of some kind, as that still essentially qualifies as new IP, whether the gamer agrees or not. In all, I suspect five (if they are indeed new IP in some way) will be accessible by the gamer in some way by the end of next year from Sony at least. The remaining fall into the categories I mentioned. I heard this promise before, and purchased a $500 console and got almost two years of grief.

And complaining that we have one game planned that's new IP next year even though we do not have knowledge of the entire line-up is crap. Surprised some of you aren't complaining Nintendo has NO GAMES planned for 2015 just yet. Christ...

That all said; I do not know why or where this Mario/new IP argument continued to cycle and snowball, but it's getting out of hand and off topic (I suspect it started from myself). As I said before, all companies get this flak, I do not think Nintendo should be void of it, but I do believe they catch more of it when they do something Mario. I blame the potential dream roster-makers of the SSB series.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby FadedAreWii » 23 Jul 2013 18:25

Hamr's weakest arguments yet. The attach rate proves it is pushing systems, and yes, 4mil+ systems is a large ammount for a couple games pushing it. 1 game pushing two million systems is significant, period. Trying to include VC games and dlc is laughable. Those are more secondary to purchase decisions. I'm not going to bother responding to the rest of your anti-nintendo, pro-sonyms drivel.

Am going to point out you keep claiming I think they will delay all but one game and this will be the second time i'm informing you that you are putting words in my mouth. Your reply reeks of desperation, as does your post history.

Edit: @ berrix.

Yeah, Nintendo gets crap for sequels being actual sequels and not completey brand new table-upending experiences more than any company.

Some of the Pikmin 3 reviews as example can be summed up:

"It's got some new tweeks that enhance the experience, but that's not enough, it's still Pikmin, boo hoo."
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Hamr » 23 Jul 2013 21:47

Berrix wrote:Half a dozen Mario platformers doesn't equate to what people, by majority, are aware of and seen.

So the problem is not the number of Mario games, but how well Nintendo is promoting them? If that is the case, then they are better served by increasing the marketing budget of the games they have already released then yet another release.

"Saying this implies a HD re-release of PS2 classics sold PS3 systems, which is not naturally the case."

Obviously. Old IPs do not provide mass market appeal. Even super-popular HD collections were not enough to prevent the PS3 from being one of the biggest disasters the industry has ever seen.

Just as none of those Mario platformers (which include retail games), are preventing the Wii U from tracking below the PS3 in a similar timeframe.

"Hell, it's surprising how many are not much aware of Super Luigi U, while in the same breath mention Mario Kart 8."

You seem to be confusing 'awareness' with 'interested in'. Nintendo is pushing New Super Luigi about as hard as they push any games: that whole 'Year of Luigi' thing, Nintendo Directs, magazine buys, and even TV spots. They are plenty aware of it; just not interested.

Mario Kart 8 gets talked about in a different light because instead of being indistinguishable in footage and screenshot from previous games, it actually appears to be doing creative new things.

"Mind you, there is never a true line where it becomes 'Too Much Mario' for Nintendo consoles. You may disagree"

It is not just me -- pretty much all schools of economic theory accept the concept of diminishing utility. You can pretend that Mario games are among the only products on the entire earth that no one ever gets sick of, but the sales data does not back that assertion up -- if anything, it very much indicates the opposite.

"New IPs don't. Looking into sales figures, BK/2 sold millions, sure but didn't do much to flux the console attachment rate."

[citation needed]

"Rythm Heaven sold more in a shorter time (shorter in total) than BK series, but did nothing to the sales figures of a declining Wii generation.""

Right, Rhythm Heaven was hugely popular and sold tons of systems when it debuted on the DS, and then by the time the series got to the Wii, it was an established IP, and comparatively no one wanted it -- because like I said, old IPs are a poor investment in this market. That example is not atypical.

"the universe of Miis seem to be Nintendo's only true IP that marked a major selling point that rivaled Mario during the Wii"

And the 'universe of Miis' was worth the neighborhood of two hundred million copies of software sold alone, along with 100 million systems.

And why restrict ourselves only to the Wii? During that same period of time, the DS was killing it, and we had almost 25 million Nintendogs games sold and twenty-million of the first Brain Age alone. Along with the Wii series, these are the games credited for making Nintendo the most successful developer and publisher of the entire decade.

That Nintendo listened to people who thought that they could replicate that kind of smash-success with a system library built almost entirely around Mario is why they are currently in the hole they are in.

"Much of that relates to a ton of reasons, from every console carrying one of their games, to utilizing the players' creativity on their Miis into a variety of games. They were essentially an extension of one's self. THEY raced against Mario, THEY triumphed against Sonic, THEY explored new territories. THEM, not the Miis, and that's reasons that made them so damn popular."

This is... surprisingly incoherent. Miis are an extension of the player, and that is what made the games popular, but the extensions of the players are not what made the games popular? What?

Are you trying to say that the Mii aesthetic did not make the Wii games popular? If so, I do not know if I can agree with that. While I personally think it looks kind of repulsive, as I am aware, most people who enjoy the games quite enjoy the clean, colorful, heavily-stylized look of the characters and would probably be turned off by a different presentation. Nintendo would seem to agree, considering how they keep reusing the artstyle. I suspect similar reasoning explains Mario's persistent reliance on the whole 'Bah-bah' music.

"Now, can Nintendo essentially do this with another IP? Sure, but it will take a lot of work to get their presence not only known of the IP, but of the console itself."

Nintendo never needed to do work to sell virtually any of the new IPs I have named so far -- new, interesting sell themselves. They never had to pay to have Wii Sports show up on every talk and news show in existence back in 2006. It was a fresh new experience. People wanted to see it, wanted to play it, wanted to buy it -- wanted to spend hundreds of dollars to do so.

"Which they fumbled on, sure, but it's recoverable even at this point."

I agree it is recoverable. But it is only recoverable to the extent that they stop listening to people espousing the failed business model they are currently following.

"We do not know of all the supposed new IPs Sony is making in the supposed next year. Some may be delayed a year, some may be delayed into oblivion."

And I readily accept the idea that 'some' may be delayed. The part that approaches absurdity is when you get into 'almost all' territory, which is what it would take for either system to have a worse first-year line-up of new IPs than the Wii U factually has.

"That's not even counting some may merge into other projects, others change into an existing IP (like Mario and Luigi from the title Tomato Adventure), complete cancellation and even be an 'app' of some kind, as that still essentially qualifies as new IP, whether the gamer agrees or not. In all, I suspect five (if they are indeed new IP in some way) will be accessible by the gamer in some way by the end of next year from Sony at least. The remaining fall into the categories I mentioned. I heard this promise before, and purchased a $500 console and got almost two years of grief."

You can make that argument, but if that is the case, then I am clearly being much too charitable in assuming that X, Mario Kart, and Bayonetta will make 2014.

"And complaining that we have one game planned that's new IP next year even though we do not have knowledge of the entire line-up is crap."

No, 'crap' is pretending that there is this secret treasure trove of new IPs that Nintendo is going to magically conjure out of thin air -- and then apparently release almost immediately after announcing them.

Why is it that we should regard games with suspicion even if they are far enough into development to have working game demos and have concrete official release windows, but we should treat games that as far as we know do not even exist with the utmost faith?

"As I said before, all companies get this flak, I do not think Nintendo should be void of it, but I do believe they catch more of it when they do something Mario."

Under what distribution why would Mario not deserve to receive more flak than any other series over that matter? There are objectively more Mario games currently on the market than any other franchise, and Mario games objectively release on a more frequent basis than any other franchise.

FadedAreWii wrote:The attach rate proves it is pushing systems

Attach rates have nothing to do with 'pushing systems'. In fact, the less systems you push, the better the attach rate ends up.

The actual number of systems being sold proves that it is not pushing systems.

"4mil+ systems is a large ammount for a couple games pushing it"

A. No, that is not actually a 'large' amount at all. 'Large' would be surpassing what Nintendo expected it to push. 'Moderate' would be selling precisely how many Nintendo projected it to move. 'Terrible' is selling well below those expectations, which is exactly what we are seeing. Pretty much everyone understands that, Nintendo most of all.

B. That is also assuming that everyone who buys NSMBU bought the entire console for the game, which is fairly dubious. For instance, despite owning NSMBU and being factored into that attach, *I* bought the system for Monster Hunter.

C. 'Amount'.

"Trying to include VC games and dlc is laughable."

I could have sworn someone earlier was complaining about Nintendo not receiving credit for their work in coming out with Earthbound or whatever. Are we now accepting the 'Virtual Console games don't count!' argument?

Well, either way, that is essentially an admission that Nintendo is wasting their time and money on all the Mario games they keep pumping out, so I will interpret this as progress.

"I'm not going to bother responding to the rest of your anti-nintendo, pro-sonyms drivel."

As someone who approach things from the perspective of business, whether facts impugn or defend a corporation's Klingon honor or whatever is honestly fairly irrelevant to me.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby FadedAreWii » 23 Jul 2013 23:35

*popcorn*

Anyone looking at it from a business perspective wouldn't say something as off as attach rate proves it isn't selling systems. Ha ha!
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Hamr » 24 Jul 2013 00:43

FadedAreWii wrote:Anyone looking at it from a business perspective wouldn't say something as off as attach rate proves it isn't selling systems.

Right, the terrible system sales are what prove Mario is not selling enough systems.

The high attach rate is merely a side effect of the low hardware sales.

For instance, if you sell a grand total of one console, then any game you ever sell for that console will have a 100% attach rate, the highest any game on any system has ever achieved. Would any company in the entire history of the world ever call that a decent business model, though?

Spoiler:
No.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Berrix » 24 Jul 2013 12:33

That can be spun in almost every terrible way possible.

Nintendo not selling more consoles that Mario shows Mario isn't selling the console.

Mario's low attachment rate to high sales show Mario isn't the one selling the console.

Wouldn't Mario selling systems express as such by having a high attachment rate? I doubt people buying consoles by Mario would just get the console and not the game.

Cyclicle arguments at its best.

Regardless though, Nintendo is pretty much in a damned to do, damned to don't situation. They make a Mario, which previously to this release, people were asking for a 'real 3D Mario' game. Which then led to this topic of Nintendo making too much Mario.

Then we got Wonderful 101 as the newest example. New IP, Nintendo supporting it, taking it to large conventions, and still many have a moderate interest in it. A damn shame if there ever was one, as that was the more amazing piece at the Nintendo Invitational prior to the console release. New and interesting sells, about 100k copies to those who own the console.

Pretty sure we'd be having this argument in circles regardless the topic game was at hand. Retro could have announed the actrocity of another Prime, we'd be here saying how 'Metroid doesn't move consoles, dated IP, not hardcore enough,' and so forth.

Hell, even if it was a new game, say Project HAMMER, how many, honestly, would you think people would purchase a system for it? Something interesting, sure, so was FlingSmash. It doesn't guarantee the promise of sales. Most of all gamers jump into the next console purchase, regardless the system, for something familiar to them first. The new generally sell much to those with the console already.

Nintendo's main problem isn't Mario, it's them AND their fanbase. Large ends of fans waiting for more than just Mario now. We're older, we know what Nintendo has, and we want them. F-Zero, Metroid, Zelda, Star Fox, Golden Sun, Sin & Punishment, all these series have fans waiting with baited breath for their series to come out. Nintendo, hell even Sony's size isn't big enough to accommodate. Nintendo's too small and their franchise roster is too large and their fans are fragmented into many, many camps. Mario can sate a ton, sure, but Mario alone isn't enough. But it sure isn't cause the lack of new IP that's killing sales, it's lack of everything else everbody else wants.

Also, would do my usual citations. However, personal PC is gone (see caught on fire), so most what I do is via Wii U. Not the greatest to type from. Hence my quotes don't happen often as well.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby ddddd » 24 Jul 2013 17:17

Berrix wrote:Nintendo's main problem isn't Mario, it's them AND their fanbase. Large ends of fans waiting for more than just Mario now. We're older, we know what Nintendo has, and we want them. F-Zero, Metroid, Zelda, Star Fox, Golden Sun, Sin & Punishment, all these series have fans waiting with baited breath for their series to come out. Nintendo, hell even Sony's size isn't big enough to accommodate. Nintendo's too small and their franchise roster is too large and their fans are fragmented into many, many camps. Mario can sate a ton, sure, but Mario alone isn't enough. But it sure isn't cause the lack of new IP that's killing sales, it's lack of everything else everbody else wants.

A solution to this could be to expand, largely, the existing estudios, creating new ones, and why not, acquire some from outside with employees that dont hate Nintendo. Rather than acknowledging this issue after the first year of WiiU's life, Id have done it through Wii's generation.
They didnt just realise what they got into after launching the WiiU, but it sure feels that way.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby KingBroly » 24 Jul 2013 18:11

I think the problems with Wii U right now have to do with the 3DS being weak at launch, and how much they scrambled to get 3DS afloat than to get Wii U afloat. OS problems, lack of Nintendo games in the pipeline, rushed games (if you look at the offerings Nintendo had through NSMB2, they were mostly lacking in content/features), the price cut/amassador program/GBA games being GBA ports instead of emulated), etc. This caused a massive manpower shift that is costing them with Wii U right now in terms of games, the poor OS, lack of titles announced, etc. You might think Wii U and the shift to HD for Nintendo is the problem for their woes, but when you look at Mario Kart 8, and how good that game looks for something that has only been in development for 18 months or so, you have to come to the conclusion that these problems started before Wii U.

I guess that's why Mario in this game (TRANSITION!) looks so out of place with Mario character models in other games, even on Wii U.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby FadedAreWii » 24 Jul 2013 18:37

Hamr wrote:
FadedAreWii wrote:Anyone looking at it from a business perspective wouldn't say something as off as attach rate proves it isn't selling systems.

Right, the terrible system sales are what prove Mario is not selling enough systems.

The high attach rate is merely a side effect of the low hardware sales.

For instance, if you sell a grand total of one console, then any game you ever sell for that console will have a 100% attach rate, the highest any game on any system has ever achieved. Would any company in the entire history of the world ever call that a decent business model, though?

Spoiler:
No.


Then every game on the system has a high attach rate! Oh... wait.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby ddddd » 24 Jul 2013 18:48

KingBroly wrote:I guess that's why Mario in this game (TRANSITION!) looks so out of place with Mario character models in other games, even on Wii U.

Didnt notice this, I thought they all looked like promo art in motion. Got examples to look at?
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby KingBroly » 24 Jul 2013 20:10

ddddd wrote:
KingBroly wrote:I guess that's why Mario in this game (TRANSITION!) looks so out of place with Mario character models in other games, even on Wii U.

Didnt notice this, I thought they all looked like promo art in motion. Got examples to look at?


Just view the opening for SM3DW's trailer where it's highlighted and compare it to any piece of promo art or character model for Mario Kart 8, 3D Land, Galaxy 1/2, etc. His face looks more comparable to Sunshine's model than games prior, so it's either a step back, not done, or completely different for no apparent reason when the promo art for 3D World is consistent with recent games.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby Mochlum » 24 Jul 2013 20:24

KingBroly wrote:
ddddd wrote:
KingBroly wrote:I guess that's why Mario in this game (TRANSITION!) looks so out of place with Mario character models in other games, even on Wii U.

Didnt notice this, I thought they all looked like promo art in motion. Got examples to look at?


Just view the opening for SM3DW's trailer where it's highlighted and compare it to any piece of promo art or character model for Mario Kart 8, 3D Land, Galaxy 1/2, etc. His face looks more comparable to Sunshine's model than games prior, so it's either a step back, not done, or completely different for no apparent reason when the promo art for 3D World is consistent with recent games.


The game actually looks VERY different in person then it does from trailers and videos. It looks much better on an HDTV screen.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby KingBroly » 24 Jul 2013 21:00

Mochlum wrote:The game actually looks VERY different in person then it does from trailers and videos. It looks much better on an HDTV screen.


That really doesn't answer what I'm saying, nor does it disprove what I said.
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Re: Super Mario 3D World

Postby FadedAreWii » 24 Jul 2013 21:18

Could be because of multiple playable characters.
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