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New Super Mario Bros. U director talks possibility of user created/shared levels in Mario's future

“I think the Coin Edit feature in Coin Battle is a step closer to that. There is a possibility of this happening in the future, but there’s no use just blindly making that feature available. We would need to carefully think about how to make such a system work. The important thing is that it has to be something that is uniquely Nintendo. Where a beginner can easily make something and have a good time, and simultaneously, someone who is really into Mario can delve into it deeper and make something more complex. So that is a challenge we will need to tackle in the future.” - Masataka Takemoto, director

It's certainly not something that will be implemented in New Super Mario Bros. U, but it seems that the idea might resurface in a future Mario title down the road.

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44 total comments (View all)
User avatar
28 Dec 2012 10:16

mariomaniac45213 wrote:It shouldn't even be a possibility it should've been or SHOULD be a reality by now (along with online play) no reason it shouldn't this day and age. I can only imagine what the millions of fans can come up with. I just hope it's more deep and involved than SSBB's level creator...

Here here. I couldnt agree more.
When it comes to 2D platformers (something Nintendo supposedly excels at) Sony has been spanking them hard with the LBP series.
User avatar
28 Dec 2012 10:20

enigmaxtreme wrote:
Frankula wrote:Nintendo needs to grow some balls. They are so afraid of turning casual gamers away from their products. They won't put a level editor and online play in mario for fear that it will take over as the "way" to play mario, causing casual players to feel left out when they can't beat the kaizo type levels that are made popular.

Seriously though, that is just pathetic. I'm getting tired of their conservativeness. They are just starting to show their age. I hope that the younger devs like Sakurai can show the older vets like Miyamoto how to make a game with deeper gameplay.


actually there is no online due to lag being a real issue

Also Nintendo definitely aren't stupid and the sure don't need to grow balls if they did we wouldn't have the Wii or Wii U they would have just given us the Gamecube 2

If lag is an issue then I shudder at the weakness of the WiiU. Fortanutely I know you are just BSing. Lag isnt the issue, the Wii isnt THAT weak.
User avatar
28 Dec 2012 10:51

Keep in mind there isn't anything stopping them from having a full 8 worlds of professional levels AND a level editor at the same time.

I do think it would be wise for Nintendo to add a level editor because it does add value and replayability to a game.

And yes you wade through a lot of badly created levels, levels made out of lewd objects, and endless remakes of other games but for me it's worth it to find those few gems out there where the creator put a lot of time, effort, and heart into their creation.

Which is why I respect Valve in that they foster an environment of user created content and highlight the quality items which is what I wish Nintendo and other companies would do. You never know you might have the next Miyamoto on your hands that only needed a canvas to work on.

Also how cool would it to be to have "developers pick" levels that the developers played and enjoyed and become featured for all to enjoy.
User avatar
28 Dec 2012 13:18

BlueRangerVegeta wrote:
enigmaxtreme wrote:
Frankula wrote:Nintendo needs to grow some balls. They are so afraid of turning casual gamers away from their products. They won't put a level editor and online play in mario for fear that it will take over as the "way" to play mario, causing casual players to feel left out when they can't beat the kaizo type levels that are made popular.

Seriously though, that is just pathetic. I'm getting tired of their conservativeness. They are just starting to show their age. I hope that the younger devs like Sakurai can show the older vets like Miyamoto how to make a game with deeper gameplay.


actually there is no online due to lag being a real issue

Also Nintendo definitely aren't stupid and the sure don't need to grow balls if they did we wouldn't have the Wii or Wii U they would have just given us the Gamecube 2

If lag is an issue then I shudder at the weakness of the WiiU. Fortanutely I know you are just BSing. Lag isnt the issue, the Wii isnt THAT weak.

Lag has nothing to do with system's power.
Lag generally has to do with servers, ISPs, and how the online mode works.

Also LBP2 is not a platformer.
User avatar
28 Dec 2012 14:21

M1 wrote:
Lag has nothing to do with system's power.
Lag generally has to do with servers, ISPs, and how the online mode works.

Also LBP2 is not a platformer.

Oh, what is it then? A FPS? A racer? RPG? RTS? Dont just say it isnt a platformwr (which it is) without backing it up.

Lag may or may not be related to what the system can handle. In Nintendos case it is laziness pure and simple. Every NSMB after the original has been a lazy cash in.
User avatar
28 Dec 2012 16:22

BlueRangerVegeta wrote:
M1 wrote:
Lag has nothing to do with system's power.
Lag generally has to do with servers, ISPs, and how the online mode works.

Also LBP2 is not a platformer.

Oh, what is it then? A FPS? A racer? RPG? RTS? Dont just say it isnt a platformwr (which it is) without backing it up.

Lag may or may not be related to what the system can handle. In Nintendos case it is laziness pure and simple. Every NSMB after the original has been a lazy cash in.

Actually LBP2 is a sandbox game since it is based around user generated content and it allows you to do as you please.

Actually it is not a case of pure laziness with any company other than Microsoft since they are a huge IT company.

All 2D games fall under the banner of lazy cash ins, as does every EA sports game, Call of Duty, HD remake, Capcom fighting game, Assassin Creed series and most franchise fighting games (yes all of these games are called lazy cash ins by gamers of all sorts).

So yeah i better not catch you buying any of the games mentioned above, I don't want you to waste your money on "lazy cash ins". So you better only buy games that feature state of the art graphics and/or are original.

Now seriously, when will you admit to being a Sony fanboy?
User avatar
28 Dec 2012 16:47

M1 wrote:All 2D games fall under the banner of lazy cash ins, as does every EA sports game, Call of Duty, HD remake, Capcom fighting game, Assassin Creed series and most franchise fighting games (yes all of these games are called lazy cash ins by gamers of all sorts).

So yeah i better not catch you buying any of the games mentioned above, I don't want you to waste your money on "lazy cash ins". So you better only buy games that feature state of the art graphics and/or are original.


Huh, sometimes you make pretty good points. :o Pretty much everything these days is refered to as a "lazy cash in" by people on these gaming websites.
User avatar
28 Dec 2012 16:50

BlueRangerVegeta wrote:
mariomaniac45213 wrote:It shouldn't even be a possibility it should've been or SHOULD be a reality by now (along with online play) no reason it shouldn't this day and age. I can only imagine what the millions of fans can come up with. I just hope it's more deep and involved than SSBB's level creator...

Here here. I couldnt agree more.
When it comes to 2D platformers (something Nintendo supposedly excels at) Sony has been spanking them hard with the LBP series.


Hi freakin larious :lol: Can't take you seriously anymore.
No Avatar
28 Dec 2012 21:04

From what I've been reading online from people far more in the know than me, the reason NSMB (all versions) don't support online isn't because Nintendo is lazy but apparently because light is.

The amount of information needed to be processed and transferred over the internet in order to support such a game with even 2 players interacting with each other and their environment in the way the game is played simply isn't physically possible. Add in 60FPS and you're completely in fantasy land if you think it's possible.

Apparently, short of solving quantum entanglement, it's never going to be possible without immense amounts of lag or having to completely redesign the way the game plays.

As for a level editor... Why? Nintendo already makes the best levels. If there was evidence that online communities were able to match, let alone surpass what Nintendo have already done, then I could see it. They haven't though, on any other similar game that supports level editors.

Besides, isn't the game going to support DLC? Why would you want to cut into your possible own sales? Nintendo is a company after all. They're entire point of existence is to make money.
No Avatar
28 Dec 2012 22:40

void3953 wrote:The amount of information needed to be processed and transferred over the internet in order to support such a game with even 2 players interacting with each other and their environment in the way the game is played simply isn't physically possible. Add in 60FPS and you're completely in fantasy land if you think it's possible.
Really? Really? Let's compare Mario and Unreal Tournament. Two players in a 2D game with a couple of buttons and digital movement in 2012... vs. 32 players with mouse (analog control) and a ton of things they can do in a fully 3D environment with bullets flying everywhere at 90 fps in 1999?

void3953 wrote:As for a level editor... Why?
Cuz it would be fun to create?
User avatar
29 Dec 2012 11:03

kevynwight wrote:
void3953 wrote:The amount of information needed to be processed and transferred over the internet in order to support such a game with even 2 players interacting with each other and their environment in the way the game is played simply isn't physically possible. Add in 60FPS and you're completely in fantasy land if you think it's possible.
Really? Really? Let's compare Mario and Unreal Tournament. Two players in a 2D game with a couple of buttons and digital movement in 2012... vs. 32 players with mouse (analog control) and a ton of things they can do in a fully 3D environment with bullets flying everywhere at 90 fps in 1999?

void3953 wrote:As for a level editor... Why?
Cuz it would be fun to create?


TOUCHE!
User avatar
29 Dec 2012 12:39

@kevynwight

Except one if a fps and the other is platformer. Plus to get those 90 fps settings you need very good PC. Try harder.
User avatar
29 Dec 2012 13:27

void3953 wrote:
The amount of information needed to be processed and transferred over the internet in order to support such a game with even 2 players interacting with each other and their environment in the way the game is played simply isn't physically possible. Add in 60FPS and you're completely in fantasy land if you think it's possible.

Apparently, short of solving quantum entanglement, it's never going to be possible without immense amounts of lag or having to completely redesign the way the game plays.


You don't know how online multiplayer works do you...
You dont' transfer the entire game at 60fps over the internet to each player. All you would be transferring between the two players are the character locations and changes that make to the environment, tiny amounts of data, and very much easily done.
Did you play Smash Bros. Brawl online? Or Mario Kart Wii/DS/7 online? Portal 2? Any other online multiplayer game?

A simple platformer like NSMBWU would be piss simple to make online.
User avatar
29 Dec 2012 13:47

OmicronTurtle wrote:

A simple platformer like NSMBWU would be piss simple to make online.


Then how come all the platformers with online multiplayer suffer horribly with inaccuracies, lag, and other issues?

Sony couldn't even get LBP to work online properly for the platforming parts.
User avatar
29 Dec 2012 20:57

@OmicronTurtle

No YOU are the one who doesn't understand how games work. Platforming requires far more precision than simple fps. NSMBWii was impossible in multiplayer 60 fps, now imagine it online with less frames and lag!

Mario Kart? Ya, its frames dropped but it didn't matter because you don't need any kind of precision in that game.

Brawl? Online sucked balls so no idea why are you using it as an argument. Plus as competitive fighting game player, online for most games is not optimal for tourney play because in these games single frames can mean the difference between winning and losing a match.

So learn about games and precisions and then come back before you try to act like professor of everyone, k?
No Avatar
30 Dec 2012 09:39

I got 90 fps in UT on a PC I owned in the year 2000. Not sure why that's relevant anyway.

Are we seriously arguing that 2 players on a simple flat x/y coordinate plane (i.e. 2D) with a very small list of digital control inputs in the year 2012 is somehow more difficult to do online than 32 players in a complex 3D environment with a much larger list of inputs including fully analog mouse control, dozens of projectiles traveling all over the place, etc. in the year 2000?

And 2D platforming requires more precision than a game where you're having to keep track of the positions of several enemies, target them in a split second, defend against projectiles coming from many directions, death from above and below, with conditions and logistics changing constantly second to second?
No Avatar
30 Dec 2012 23:34

kevynwight wrote:I got 90 fps in UT on a PC I owned in the year 2000. Not sure why that's relevant anyway.

Are we seriously arguing that 2 players on a simple flat x/y coordinate plane (i.e. 2D) with a very small list of digital control inputs in the year 2012 is somehow more difficult to do online than 32 players in a complex 3D environment with a much larger list of inputs including fully analog mouse control, dozens of projectiles traveling all over the place, etc. in the year 2000?

And 2D platforming requires more precision than a game where you're having to keep track of the positions of several enemies, target them in a split second, defend against projectiles coming from many directions, death from above and below, with conditions and logistics changing constantly second to second?

You are arguing that, I never mentioned anything of the like.

Imagine being even one frame off in a game like NSMBU. Instead of bumping into another character like you're supposed to, you pass through him. Or you deflect off of them incorrectly. Now imagine a system trying to get that correct with 4 players all interacting with each other as well as the environment in 60 FPS. It's not going to happen unless you're playing over a LAN. Lag alone would kill it.

FPS games use all kinds of tricks and even then the lag and issues are very apparent. You can shoot another player in your game and they may not see it for several frames. And how would they know any different? A lot of times you don't even see who kills you. How would you know if they actually shot you 1/5th of a second before you actually died in your game? In NSMBU, everyone would know really quickly if something went wrong.

Fighting games are very similar in that regard. They use animations to mask delay and predictive algorithms to determine what to do next even over slow internet connections. Can you use some of those tricks with a game like NSMBU? Yeah, but they'll only help so much.

Without having accurate data for every frame a game like NSMBU would become a huge mess.

Of course, this is information that I've gleaned from people far more in the know than I am.
User avatar
31 Dec 2012 19:13

@kevynwight

"I got 90 fps in UT on a PC I owned in the year 2000."

Pics or it never happened.

"And 2D platforming requires more precision than a game where you're having to keep track of the positions of several enemies, target them in a split second, defend against projectiles coming from many directions, death from above and below, with conditions and logistics changing constantly second to second?"

Ya, you don't know what is precision. Those things in fps don't require precision.

When you shoot a person not all your bullets have to hit and not all your bullets will hit. Not the same kind of precision! You comparison is terrible goes to show your lack of knowledge about games.

@void3953

Actually in fighting games, it's pretty hard to make a good online structure for the same reason as platformers. One frame can be the difference between winning and losing, same as what you said about online platforming.
User avatar
31 Dec 2012 19:19

How has one person modded Super Mario 64 to have ONLINE multiplayer, with no apparent game-breaking lag and latency that operates as if its local multiplayer?
User avatar
31 Dec 2012 20:45

@OmicronTurtle

There's no game breaking lag because there is no game to break. Mario 64's platforming is virtually non-existant (open-world level design) and what little there is, is nowhere near the level of precision of NSMBWii. This stuff isn't that hard to figure out!
User avatar
31 Dec 2012 21:01

MegaShock100 wrote:@OmicronTurtle

There's no game breaking lag because there is no game to break. Mario 64's platforming is virtually non-existant (open-world level design) and what little there is, is nowhere near the level of precision of NSMBWii. This stuff isn't that hard to figure out!


You keep spouting on about the extreme "precision" a simple 2D platformer like NSMBWii/U requires, yet you can't seem to explain this "precision". Humour us simple folk, and explain why a simple 2D platformer like NSMBWii/U has such "precision" ?

You do know what a 2-Dimensional plane is versus a 3-Dimensional Plane yes? I'll give you a hint, we operate in a 3-Dimensional Plane (well some may say 4-Dimensional but lets not confuse ourselves any further)

Oh and there's are mods for Super Mario World and Super Mario Bros. 3 that also enable online multiplayer.
And if you try to claim that either of those games have less "precision" than NSMBWii/U then don't bother even replying. Seriously, just don't, because if you do then you will have cemented my opinion of you as someone who lacks basic education and I will marvel that you have not yet managed to hurt yourself by operating a computer.

Happy 2013 - try to maybe read a book or something.
User avatar
31 Dec 2012 21:13

@OmicronTurtle

Precision is jumpin from platform to platform and the level of error allowed between success and falling in a pit. That's not rocket-surgery. Though I expect this kind of fail comprehension from someone named OmicromTurtle, yet his avatar is a dog. Doesn't even know the difference between common every day animals, lmao. And you're saying I like basic education, L-O-L! xD

Mods for 10-20 year old games vs. a modern 60fps polygonal game with 4 player multiplayer, far more moving stuff on-screen, etc. And I haven't seen those mods, so I don't comment on their levels of precision, but my bet is, yeah, they're no where close to NSMBWii.

I've played one online Mario mod called Super Mario Wars... it's fun, but there is no platforming precision, you just have to worry about jumping on other characters. NSMBWii, you have quality platoforming and, something you and Kevin boy up there have totally ignore, 4 other people jumping around going crazy so! Sorry, but fail argument is fail and therefore you are failure!
No Avatar
01 Jan 2013 03:41

@void3953

Actually in fighting games, it's pretty hard to make a good online structure for the same reason as platformers. One frame can be the difference between winning and losing, same as what you said about online platforming.

Which is why I mention using animations to mask lag and predictive algorithms. Again, that's second hand knowledge though so I don't know how it all, or even how well it all works but from sources I've read it's still supposed to be far easier than trying to get something like NSMBU working online, which apparently is currently impossible.
No Avatar
02 Jan 2013 02:02

I don't need "pics" of my UT machine. I had a Voodoo5 5500 on a Windows 98SE machine (can't recall the CPU) and got in the 80 to 100 fps range. It's not that difficult.

So my brother just had surgery on both knees on Monday morning, so I brought over the Wii U and PS3 today to hang out with him. We ended up playing quite a bit of NSMBU with two players, which was new for me. It was a ton of fun! Silly, goofy, players in the same room fun. Granted, we killed each other a few times, but being able to resurrect the other player meant we were able to breeze through the levels.

But precision? Holy cow! :lol: Give me a break already!! The level of commitment and the level of forgiveness is on such a vastly different plane of existence (see what I did there?) that I can only conclude you've either never really played a first-person shooter against stiff competition, or you're very young and naive, or you're just sort of munted and demented. Grow up and realize what you're trying to contend is absurd and makes you sound disappointingly deluded. :lol:
User avatar
02 Jan 2013 21:18

@kevynwight

"I don't need "pics" of my UT machine. I had a Voodoo5 5500 on a Windows 98SE machine (can't recall the CPU) and got in the 80 to 100 fps range. It's not that difficult."

Ya sureeee. No pics=never happened.

"It was a ton of fun. Silly, goofy, players in the same room fun."

Indeed it is! :D

"Granted, we killed each other a few times,"

Only a few times? Wow you guys must have been in a really chummy mood. Must have been the fact that he just got out of surgery. NSMB multiplayer is 98% if the time trying to destroy others.

"But precision? Holy cow! Give me a break already!! The level of commitment and the level of forgiveness is on such a vastly different plane of existence (see what I did there?) that I can only conclude you've either never really played a first-person shooter against stiff competition"

No, I doubt you've played fps against competition because you won't post pics.

NSMB requires far more precision with 4 players trying to kill each other on a space full of moving platforms and threats then trying to shoot someone with a stream of 100 bullets on geometrically basic levels. That is objective facts!

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